Talk:Decembrist revolt

Untitled

The Decembrists are all изменник, предатель to Holy Mother Russia. I am not the only one who knows this.

The article says that the Russian officer corps and army was responsible for the defeat of Napoleon, but the incompetence of the Generals on each side was even more self destructive. Also, the peasant population of Russia were very effective in guerilla campaigns, unlike the Russian army. I think the article should reflect this.

Anecdotal remark?

Nicholas died after catching pneumonia visiting his troops in the field during 1855. The official russian defeat was concluded with the Treaty of Paris in 1856, so it is unlikely that Nicholas said anything following the Russian defeat in the Crimean war.

The date

Under which date should the event be listed? Old style, new style, or both? Currently it is listed under December 14#Events. BACbKA 10:05, 6 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Exiles also went to Central Asia?

I propose changing the phrase "exiled to Siberia and the Far East" to "exiled to Siberia, Central Asia, and the Far East." Unfortunately I don't have the documentation anymore, but in the city where I used to live (Ust'-Kamenogorsk, Kazakhstan) we attributed some of our civic development to exiled Decembrists who moved there. They made the town a lot better (is the story) -- they built the first firehouse, with a little watchtower on top; they say it made a big difference in a day when the structures were almost all wood and the town often suffered devastating fires. I learned this years ago at the local history museum there, I've moved since then, and these are all recollections from memory.

Arguably at the time Kazakhstan simply WAS just another chunk of Siberia, but I don't think that's the best label to use anymore. And I have this notion that the exiles scattered about Central Asia, not just to this one city. Does anybody have more data about this??

LandruBek 12:16, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

Although Kazakhstan was a part of the Russian Empire in the 1820s, most of the rest of what we call "Central Asia" wasn't. We would have to be quite specific about our terminology if we were to add other places of exile. Ahasuerus 16:28, 20 March 2006 (UTC)

In literature

British Dan: I was wondering if anyone could help me? The article refers to Herzen, Pushkin, Neksasov and Tolstoy all honouring the Decembrists in some manner. Could anyone specifically point me in the direction of the relevant newspapers, poems and novels in which this is done? Many thanks.

Pushkin wrote several moving verse epistles to his friends the Decembrists; the first volume of his Sovremennik opened with "The Feast of Peter I", a disguised plea to the tsar to grant a pardon to the Decembrists. Nekrasov wrote a tedious narrative poem "The Russian Women", about the Decembrist wives who followed their husbands to Siberia. Tolstoy authored "The Decembrists", a novel which gradually evolved into "War and Peace". I'm not sure about Herzen, but "My Past and Thoughts" opens with his (and Ogarev's) vow to carry on the campaign started by the Decembrists; the cover of his London periodical shows the silhouettes of those Decembrists executed after the rebellion. --Ghirla ^-трёп- 06:47, 3 October 2006 (UTC)

Dan: Thank you. I understand that Lenin referred favourably to the Decemberists, how are they remembered in post-Soviet Russia? monuments? street names etc?

The article says -"With the failure of the Decembrists, Russia's monarchial absolutism would continue for another century, although serfdom would be officially abolished in 1861." the Revolt took place in 1825 and Russia had constitution in 1906. The monarchy disappeared in 1917, - from 1925 to 1906, hardly a full century.Roobit

Article not well organized

JamesW: The article is somewhat confusing. The northern and southern societies are introduced without explanation; Nicholas II puts down the northern revolt in paragraph 2, then it continues in the next three paragraphs; the southern society lunches an insurrection, but where is not indicated (was it Moscow)) A standard organization of an article of this type would be: 1. Summary; 2: Antecedents (the two societies and their membership, influence of French Revolution and Napoleonic wars. objectives of plotters, etc) 3. The course of the revolts and their failure; 4. Aftermath (punishments, exiles, Tsar's policy; 5. Long-term impact; 6. Assessment. I'm sorry I can't help on any of this. ≈≈≈≈JamesW≈≈≈≈ 4 May 2007

The name "Decembrist"

Why is there no explanation on how the rebel group became known as "The Decembrist"?

If it was because the revolted in December, then the name "Decemberist" would make sense, but without the "e" there, "Decembrist" seems arbitrary and unnatural. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 192.75.71.133 (talk) 01:39, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Victims

There is some information in the Russian Wikipedia article about victims of the revolt. More then 1200 people were killed and only 300 of them took part in the confrontation. I think this figures should be mentioned.

Opening

The opening of the article makes it seem as if the motivations of the Decembrists were simply a preference for one monarch over another, implying that the revolt was akin to a royal squabble. In fact, the article goes on to state that they had much greater ambitions, hoping to reform Russian government and society. They simply attempted to take advantage of the confusion surrounding Constantine's public announcement. Their professed loyalty to Constantine was just a method for accomplishing their goals; a way of justifying their rebellious actions at a time when challenging the monarchy was an act that bordered on heresy. The opening should be changed to better reflect the character of the revolt. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 107.5.85.111 (talk) 07:36, 18 February 2012 (UTC)

I know it's been more than 12 years, but I have attempted to implement this suggestion. JosiahRFoster (talk) 19:12, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

Monument

Who erected the monument to the Decembrists in St. Petersburg -- the Soviets? It would be interesting to know this, with something about the motivation for it, and to have a translation of the plaque text pictured in the second photo.

Sca (talk) 15:20, 14 November 2012 (UTC)

Yes, the Soviets. The motivation was to glorify the first revolutionary movement in Russia. The plaque text is as follows:

Upon this place
on 13/25 July 1826
were executed the decembrists
P. Pestel
K. Ryleyev
P. Kakhovsky
S. Muravyov-Apostol
M. Bestuzhev-Ryumin

BACbKA (talk) 01:32, 17 November 2012 (UTC)

Thanks. If you know when it was erected, perhaps you could add this and the above information to the article? Sca (talk) 15:31, 20 November 2012 (UTC)

Ugh... no, I don't, sorry :-( as for the above information on motivation, the only source I had is what I had learned at a school in St. Petersburg (then Leningrad), so, naturally, it's rooted in Soviet propaganda. BACbKA (talk) 10:47, 26 November 2012 (UTC)

"In 1940, a monument was erected on Dekabristov Island where the 5 hanged Decembrists had been supposedly buried. In 1975, another monument was put at the place of execution." Source: Saint Petersburg Encyclopedia --Petercorless (talk) 21:00, 13 May 2014 (UTC)

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Needs explanation

The lede says:

Russian army officers led about 3,000 soldiers in a protest against Tsar Nicholas I's assumption of the throne after his elder brother Constantine removed himself from the line of succession.

This incident is not referenced in the article. We aren't told the circumstances. Valetude (talk) 20:59, 5 March 2019 (UTC)

Lead paragraph is confusing

The lead paragraph is confusing. It should summarize the essence of the conflict, but it uses coup, rebels and conspirators to descrobe, I presume, the same group of people. It uses loyalists to describe the other side, while the set up is that it wasn't really know exactly who was tsar. In the same vein it mentions that the Tsar's envoy was killed, but again who was tsar was in dispute - Constantine was supposed to be the tsar and he had declined, but no one knew it? So was it Constantine's envoy who was killed or Nicholas' who had seized the throne so to speak. I hope someone who knows what happened can improve the lead paragraph. I think I worked it out and have made suggestions for editing the lead paragraph below:

Alexander's heir apparent, Constantine, had privately declined the succession, unknown to the court, and his younger brother Nicholas decided to seize power as Tsar Nicholas I, pending formal confirmation. While some of the army had sworn loyalty to Nicholas, a force of about 3,000 troops tried to mount a military coup in favour of Constantine. The rebels (pro-Constantine) were weakened by dissension between their leaders, but confronted the loyalists (pro-Nicholas) outside the Senate in the presence of a large crowd. In the confusion, Tsar [Nicholas'] envoy was assassinated, and the loyalists responded with heavy artillery which scattered the rebels. Many were sentenced to hanging, prison or exile to Siberia. The pro-Constantine conspirators became known as the Decembrists

Scarykitty (talk) 03:02, 10 December 2020 (UTC)

I have attempted to work this out. Hopefully we have the start of something that is more clear, but of course any feedback is welcome. JosiahRFoster (talk) 19:14, 11 July 2024 (UTC)

Article confusing?... yes

Is the "Prince Eugene Obolensky" the same as "Prince Obolensky" the same as "Eugene Obolensky" - none of which have any link or page - the same as Yevgeny Obolensky ? Could someone corral all these Russian princes? (Note also the linked page doesn't mention half the details mentioned in this article!) Shenme (talk) 01:16, 26 December 2020 (UTC)

Lead paragraph confusing, yes!

"While some of the army had sworn loyalty to Nicholas, a force of about 3,000 troops tried to mount a military coup in favour of Constantine. The rebels, although weakened by dissension between their leaders, confronted the loyalists"

Which group is the rebels and which is the loyalists?