Talk:Chariot

Celts/Britons

Would it be more accurate to change 'Celt'to 'Briton' in the Iron Age sections? The Gauls did use them, but the use had died out by Classical times and I understand that the only evidence we have for them comes from Britain.

Mon Vier 17th March 2006 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mon Vier (talk • contribs) 20:53, 17 March 2006 (UTC)

Mitannians and Chariot Warfare

The following is the justification used for deleting the sentence: "The introduction of horse training and chariots for warfare to the Bronze Age Ancient Near East seems to be due to the Mitanni." This sentence appears at the beginning of the "Hittite" section.

1. ca. 2000 - 1800 BC: Sintashta and Krivoe Ozero chariot burial radio-carbon dates
2. Earliest depictions of a two-wheeled, spoked, horse-drawn chariot:
   • ca. 1906 - ca. 1830: Anatolia - karum Kanish II era cylinder seals
   • Teracotta plaque from Uruk - Believed to be contemporary or slightly later than the Anatolian seals
3. 18th - 17th centuries BC: Numerous seals from Syria depicting the continuing evolution of the chariot - first depictions of two-man true chariots. Connections between the platform and straddle cars of previous eras to the true chariot are clear in these depictions.
4. Late 18th century: The Anitta text mentions that the ruler of Salatiwara marched against Anitta, bringing "1,400 troops, (and) 40 teams of horses". The "teams of horses" is believed to be a reference to chariots, as that is how they were sometimes referred to.
5. ca. 1650 - 1620: The use of chariots in warfare is textually well established by such Hittite documents as "The Seige of Ursu" and the annals of the reign of Hattusili I. The Palace Anecdotes compiled by Mursili I explicitly discuss the training of chariot warriors.
6. ca. 1497 - 1482 BC: First appearance of Mitanni, as "Maittani", in an inscription believed to date from the reign of Thutmose I of Egypt.
7. First half of 15th century BC - Reign of Idri-mi of Alalah, who submitted himself to the Mitannian king Parattarna. Parattarna is believed to have had two predecessors, Shuttarna, and before him Kirta, the supposed founder of the Mitannian dynasty. Kirta is tentatively placed at the beginning of the 15th century, but could be pushed back into the late 16th century. His very existence, however, is uncertain.
8. Late(?) 15th century BC - The oldest versions of the Kikkuli of Mittanni horse-training text were composed in Middle Hittite.

If these dates are accepted, then you can see that the Hittites, and indeed all of Mesopotamia, were using chariots before the rise of Mitanni. This would mean that, while the Hittites may have acquired new chariot skills/techniques from the Mitannians, it was simply another stage in chariot evolution, not its introduction. In regard to this sentence under question, it is worth noting that there is a school of thought that the chariot developed in Mesopotamia. Even with the Sintashta and Krivoe Ozero evidence, this cannot be dismissed out of hand, as the available Mesopotamian artwork depicts no sudden jump in chariot development, but rather a smooth evolution of forms.

I will resist deleting the sentence in question a second time until this discussion has had a chance to be reveiwed and commented on.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.109.169.10 (talk) 19:35, 15 April 2006 (UTC)

Please update with: "The origins and spread of domestic horses from the Western Eurasian steppes"

I think it would be good to add info from this studiy to the article. It's currently featured in 2021 in science like so:

Scientists report that, according to their analysis, today's domestic horses descend from the lower Volga-Don region, Russia. 273 ancient horse genomes further indicate that these populations replaced almost all local populations as they expanded rapidly throughout Eurasia from about 4200 years ago, that certain adaptations were strongly selected for by horse riding, and that equestrian material culture – including Sintashta spoke-wheeled chariots and in the case of Asia Indo-Iranian languages – spread alongside.

I also uploaded CC BY images from the study but they may not be relevant to this article. The article Sintashta could be expanded with some short info from the study.

References

Prototyperspective (talk) 21:07, 22 November 2021 (UTC)

Web sources

Is there really any purpose for the "Web sources" section? Shouldn't they just be regular references?   ▶ I am Grorp ◀ 07:49, 22 December 2023 (UTC)